It’s the parent’s responsibility to educate their children about such things. I would have no problem if my child wanted to dress up like a monster for Halloween, but then, I did the same thing as a child.
When the pastor called all the children to the front of the church on Sunday, they asked the children what they were going to be for Halloween (it fit with their message). You got some princesses, a spider-man, a firefighter, etc. But you also got the occasional ‘flying zombie vampire’. Kids have imaginations – most often, harmless imaginations.
This is why a 6 year old can be dressed like a zombie while holding his little sister’s hand who is dressed like a princess as they walk up to trick-or-treat. What a sweet zombie. No biggie.
Sounds reasonable to to me. Seems this is one topic we CAN give too much thought to.
Our fears of giving honor to Satan aside by paricipating....what SHOULD be harmless entertainment USED to actually be harmless entertainment. If there is a way for us to screw that up though, I'm sure we can find it.
I think Greg is onto a change in the culture. I think parents are much more comfortable with taking their children to a church that is hosting a "harvest festival" than to a neighborhood and going door-to-door.
I answer this question every year as well and because of that I have put up a post on this very question at my blog. I think before one can make the "decision of conscience" Greg speaks of, they must know what the occultic connections are. This is what I address in my post.
If Christians find nothing objectionable about Halloween, I simply ask if they feel the same way about the Muslim Ramadan or the Hindu Diwali celebrations?
If one feels Christians should not indulge in such (Ramadan, Diwali) pagan festivals worshiping false gods, then one is being inconsistent when it comes to Halloween.
What did you think of Greg’s part on intent? You’re comparing dressing up and giving out candy for kids to celebrating Ramadan as a Christian?
Kpolo, because this is your belief, I definitely think you should abstain from Halloween. But to conclude that those that do like to handout candy and dress up are celebrating “false gods” is a little much.
@KWM,
I understand your train of thought, but I think you need some clarity in your point. In other words, why is passing out candy and dressing up not celebrating Halloween?
@ Everyone
If participating in Halloween is a matter of conscience, how do we square this with 1 Corinthians 8:9, "Be careful, however, that the exercise of your freedom does not become a stumbling block to the weak"?
You can always find someone "offended" by just about anything we might find entertaining. Our guide IS 1 Cor 8:9. though. This verse is simply asking us to put the needs of others first
However...I would not be above asking the offended to state WHY he is offended before i made the decision not to do the deed. People have been known to play mind control games. (it seems to be VERY popular in the mainstream culture today) Many times people are more interested in simpy seeing how much influence they may have with you. Those kind of people might could benefit from a little offending in my opinion.
The only thing being celebrated is the giving out of candy to kids and playing dress-up. There is the distinction - the nature of the celebration. In other words, the celebration is so surface to be meaningless. There is nothing morally or spiritually significant in the celebration if done in this manner.
As for your second question: It seems there is no problem, unless the extra candy will but on a few extra pounds.
I read your blog post. I'm wondering what your stance on Christmas and Easter is in the light of what you said.
As far as the 1 Cor 8 passage is concerned, I think that it is often misquoted to impose a law of sorts on people. What Paul is saying in this passage (which deals with food offered to idols) is that we know that there is only one God and none other. There's nothing special about food offered to idols because it was offered to nothing. However, Paul exhorts the Corinthians to be motivated by love. If they know anyone who is of "weak conscience", they should avoid eating that food in the weaker brother's presence (v 10). Notice in verse 9, Paul mentions their freedom and not letting it become a stumbling block to others. Paul does not deny their freedom but admonishes those who have no problems (and rightfully so) in eating food offered to idols to act in love toward those who have trouble justifying eating the food. Paul says, you have freedom to eat, but you also have freedom not to eat, and your eating has no impact on your position in Christ. Therefore, let love be your motivating force in eating or not eating.
Similarly, with Halloween, kids dressing up in costumes and going door-to-door getting candy hardly constitutes as witchcraft, performing divinations, and the like (nor is it "redeeming" the holiday for that matter). For Christians, I don't think that it is a sin to dress up and get candy during Halloween anymore than it's a sin to open gifts on Christmas morning. We are free to celebrate the holiday as long as we are not doing something that is explicitly prohibited in Scripture. But remember, we should exercise our freedom in love, and if it should wreck the faith of another by celebrating the holiday, it would be better for us to choose not to celebrate it.
Nathaniel,
I think you understood exactly where I was going with my question about 1 Corinthians. I don't view that as a legalistic passage that I can use to whip another Christian into my belief about Halloween or any other "matter of conscience." But I think too many Christians don't stop to think about how their stance on the holiday affects other Christians, particularly new(er) Christians.
Since you read my post on Halloween, I think you realize that I am not a fundamentalist who thinks if you even think about handing out candy then you are sinning, but I do think people should stop and think about it before they participate in it. I have written about Easter on my blog as well, but I will summarize my position. I don't think Christians should be participating in easter egg hunts and the like. Mainly because it is completely godless and distracts from the point of the celebration--the resurrection of Jesus Christ. I have not posted anything on Christmas, but will be later this year as it approaches. However, my family celebrates Christmas and we do it in a fashion that exalts Christ. That is the crux of my position on all three of those holidays...the way we celebrate them should magnify Christ and reach out with the gospel to our children and the world around us.
KWM,
I think understand that your are saying if our intentions are godly, then it is okay to celebrate the holiday? Would you agree that this is your position?
No – I don’t think so. There are no intentions (of real consequence) other than kids having fun. That being said, I think this is comprehensively benign.
>>”I don't think Christians should be participating in Easter egg hunts and the like.”
What if, inside the egg, were Bible verses that the kids got to read at the end of the hunt? Olon, the only reason I ask this is because we need to understand what these activities are at the core. That is, what are the true intentions of those participating in a game of little toddlers walking around looking for eggs? I fall into the camp that this is a joyful thing, something to have fun with – at the same time understanding the significance of Easter. It's possible to do both.
KWM,
Would you find anything wrong with Christians lighting up oil lamps to decorate their house on Diwali as there is nothing wrong with the isolated action of "lighting up oil lamps?"
My point is there is nothing wrong with dressing up and giving out candy. My question is the need to do it on Halloween day.
Regarding Easter eggs - I would contend that engaging in these non-biblical fun activities ultimately undermines the communication of the significance of the day. Scores of secular, cultural-church goers today associate easter with the kid-oriented activity of egg hunting.
I would contend the same for Christmas and x-mas trees. x-mas is already in my opinion turning into a self-serving shameful holiday of gifts and excesses. Case in point: See how the secular world has hijacked x-mas by replacing the central message of the birth of the savior with trees, decorations, gifts, rampant commercialism, "holiday" songs and the like.
I wouldn't look down upon or belittle a Christian engaging in Halloween. I would however advocate reasons to abstain from doing so. Hope this helps to clarify my position.
What if it was my family’s tradition to make Deluxe French Toast (which is amazing) on Easter morning for all the family before church? Year after year this is what we did.
>>”Would you find anything wrong with Christians lighting up oil lamps to decorate their house on Diwali as there is nothing wrong with the isolated action of "lighting up oil lamps?"
I would find this very peculiar indeed – mainly because they are performing a ritual that has a religious meaning to many Hindus. The practice is “owned” in other words. I don’t see the evidence for this with Halloween. I don't think the comparison is a valid one.
Is it at all possible that church is capitulating to the occult by giving up the holiday of All Hallows Eve to the pagans?
It's OUR holiday-- we co-opted it over the pagan harvest feasts and celebration of the occult when the church placed All Saints on November 1. That's what the church does: it gives the message of redemption by helping change pagans to Christians and pagan markings of time to faithful making of time.
Now churches offer generic "harvest festivals" as alternatives to the originally Christian holiday that attempted to "redeem" harvest festivals from their pagan origins! Which is most pagan in it's roots-- harvest festivals or All Saints Eve?
Not a big deal, and perhaps the church capitulated to the occult too long ago on this holiday for it to retain any redeeming value. But I don't think so, so I'm hanging on by taking the chance to teach my kids about the Saints of the church, living and dead, who witness to us about God's goodness. And I encourage them to dress in such a way as to inspire that thinking in others as they play games, thank God for his goodness, and eat lots of candy!
KWM:
Having a tradition of doing something for a festival is not wrong. Turning the festival into an observance of the tradition is wrong. So have french toast is fine, but if 3 generations from now, someone in your household knows nothing about Easter other than "French toast" you have a problem.
Dressing up is definitely an "owned" practice of Halloween - dressing up in gory costumes. The fact that some choose not to adorn themselves in gory costumes would be the equivalent of putting up electrical lights for Diwali instead of oil lamps.
My point is the same: why do we feel the necessity to do anything on that day? Why not celebrate "reformation day" instead? Why not celebrate the Pentecost? Why not observe a Christian martyr's day to remind ourselves of the brothers and sisters who paid for their faith with their lives?
Can we not rise above this petty holiday called Halloween? Are Christians so deprived of reasons to celebrate or days to observe?
Let me say at the outset that I really understand and sympathize with your position – maybe more than you think I do.
>>”So have french toast is fine, but if 3 generations from now, someone in your household knows nothing about Easter other than "French toast" you have a problem.”
Of course that’s a problem, but that’s not what we were discussing. I was defending Easter egg hunts with my example. I never said, "throw out the true meaning of Easter in favor of more egg hunts." Of course if all one knows of Easter is egg hunts there is a problem. But you said, I believe, that they should be avoided. I disagree. You didn’t address my question about the Bible verses in the eggs. The whole point should be to understand the significance of the day – having an egg hunt for little ones hardly negates this. In other words, they can coexist.
>>”Dressing up is definitely an "owned" practice of Halloween - dressing up in gory costumes.”
When I said “owned,” I meant the practice of lighting oil lamps for Diwali is owned by the Hindus. It’s their practice. Which group owns Halloween? The Christians that I know, don’t attach any significance to the day – it’s meaningless. Dress-up and costumes – that’s it. This goes back to Greg's piece on intent.
>>”My point is the same: why do we feel the necessity to do anything on that day?”
I don’t think it’s a “necessity”. In other words, if for some odd reason (like being stuck in an airport) I missed Halloween this year I wouldn’t care one bit. If one the other hand, I missed Easter or Christmas, it would matter.
Where's the video?
Posted by: brgulker | October 26, 2009 at 05:56 AM
It’s the parent’s responsibility to educate their children about such things. I would have no problem if my child wanted to dress up like a monster for Halloween, but then, I did the same thing as a child.
When the pastor called all the children to the front of the church on Sunday, they asked the children what they were going to be for Halloween (it fit with their message). You got some princesses, a spider-man, a firefighter, etc. But you also got the occasional ‘flying zombie vampire’. Kids have imaginations – most often, harmless imaginations.
This is why a 6 year old can be dressed like a zombie while holding his little sister’s hand who is dressed like a princess as they walk up to trick-or-treat. What a sweet zombie. No biggie.
Posted by: KWM | October 26, 2009 at 07:37 AM
Sounds reasonable to to me. Seems this is one topic we CAN give too much thought to.
Our fears of giving honor to Satan aside by paricipating....what SHOULD be harmless entertainment USED to actually be harmless entertainment. If there is a way for us to screw that up though, I'm sure we can find it.
Posted by: Vic | October 26, 2009 at 07:43 AM
I think Greg is onto a change in the culture. I think parents are much more comfortable with taking their children to a church that is hosting a "harvest festival" than to a neighborhood and going door-to-door.
I answer this question every year as well and because of that I have put up a post on this very question at my blog. I think before one can make the "decision of conscience" Greg speaks of, they must know what the occultic connections are. This is what I address in my post.
Posted by: Olon Hyde | October 26, 2009 at 07:58 AM
If Christians find nothing objectionable about Halloween, I simply ask if they feel the same way about the Muslim Ramadan or the Hindu Diwali celebrations?
If one feels Christians should not indulge in such (Ramadan, Diwali) pagan festivals worshiping false gods, then one is being inconsistent when it comes to Halloween.
Posted by: kpolo | October 26, 2009 at 09:13 AM
Hi kpolo,
What did you think of Greg’s part on intent? You’re comparing dressing up and giving out candy for kids to celebrating Ramadan as a Christian?
Kpolo, because this is your belief, I definitely think you should abstain from Halloween. But to conclude that those that do like to handout candy and dress up are celebrating “false gods” is a little much.
Posted by: KWM | October 26, 2009 at 09:35 AM
@KWM,
I understand your train of thought, but I think you need some clarity in your point. In other words, why is passing out candy and dressing up not celebrating Halloween?
@ Everyone
If participating in Halloween is a matter of conscience, how do we square this with 1 Corinthians 8:9, "Be careful, however, that the exercise of your freedom does not become a stumbling block to the weak"?
Posted by: Olon Hyde | October 26, 2009 at 09:52 AM
Olon....
You can always find someone "offended" by just about anything we might find entertaining. Our guide IS 1 Cor 8:9. though. This verse is simply asking us to put the needs of others first
However...I would not be above asking the offended to state WHY he is offended before i made the decision not to do the deed. People have been known to play mind control games. (it seems to be VERY popular in the mainstream culture today) Many times people are more interested in simpy seeing how much influence they may have with you. Those kind of people might could benefit from a little offending in my opinion.
Posted by: Vic | October 26, 2009 at 11:04 AM
Hi Olon:
The only thing being celebrated is the giving out of candy to kids and playing dress-up. There is the distinction - the nature of the celebration. In other words, the celebration is so surface to be meaningless. There is nothing morally or spiritually significant in the celebration if done in this manner.
As for your second question: It seems there is no problem, unless the extra candy will but on a few extra pounds.
Posted by: KWM | October 26, 2009 at 11:22 AM
Olon,
I read your blog post. I'm wondering what your stance on Christmas and Easter is in the light of what you said.
As far as the 1 Cor 8 passage is concerned, I think that it is often misquoted to impose a law of sorts on people. What Paul is saying in this passage (which deals with food offered to idols) is that we know that there is only one God and none other. There's nothing special about food offered to idols because it was offered to nothing. However, Paul exhorts the Corinthians to be motivated by love. If they know anyone who is of "weak conscience", they should avoid eating that food in the weaker brother's presence (v 10). Notice in verse 9, Paul mentions their freedom and not letting it become a stumbling block to others. Paul does not deny their freedom but admonishes those who have no problems (and rightfully so) in eating food offered to idols to act in love toward those who have trouble justifying eating the food. Paul says, you have freedom to eat, but you also have freedom not to eat, and your eating has no impact on your position in Christ. Therefore, let love be your motivating force in eating or not eating.
Similarly, with Halloween, kids dressing up in costumes and going door-to-door getting candy hardly constitutes as witchcraft, performing divinations, and the like (nor is it "redeeming" the holiday for that matter). For Christians, I don't think that it is a sin to dress up and get candy during Halloween anymore than it's a sin to open gifts on Christmas morning. We are free to celebrate the holiday as long as we are not doing something that is explicitly prohibited in Scripture. But remember, we should exercise our freedom in love, and if it should wreck the faith of another by celebrating the holiday, it would be better for us to choose not to celebrate it.
Posted by: Nathaniel | October 26, 2009 at 11:39 AM
Nathaniel,
I think you understood exactly where I was going with my question about 1 Corinthians. I don't view that as a legalistic passage that I can use to whip another Christian into my belief about Halloween or any other "matter of conscience." But I think too many Christians don't stop to think about how their stance on the holiday affects other Christians, particularly new(er) Christians.
Since you read my post on Halloween, I think you realize that I am not a fundamentalist who thinks if you even think about handing out candy then you are sinning, but I do think people should stop and think about it before they participate in it. I have written about Easter on my blog as well, but I will summarize my position. I don't think Christians should be participating in easter egg hunts and the like. Mainly because it is completely godless and distracts from the point of the celebration--the resurrection of Jesus Christ. I have not posted anything on Christmas, but will be later this year as it approaches. However, my family celebrates Christmas and we do it in a fashion that exalts Christ. That is the crux of my position on all three of those holidays...the way we celebrate them should magnify Christ and reach out with the gospel to our children and the world around us.
Posted by: Olon Hyde | October 26, 2009 at 12:08 PM
KWM,
I think understand that your are saying if our intentions are godly, then it is okay to celebrate the holiday? Would you agree that this is your position?
Posted by: Olon Hyde | October 26, 2009 at 12:11 PM
Hi Olon:
No – I don’t think so. There are no intentions (of real consequence) other than kids having fun. That being said, I think this is comprehensively benign.
That is my position.
Posted by: KWM | October 26, 2009 at 12:19 PM
Olon:
You wrote:
>>”I don't think Christians should be participating in Easter egg hunts and the like.”
What if, inside the egg, were Bible verses that the kids got to read at the end of the hunt? Olon, the only reason I ask this is because we need to understand what these activities are at the core. That is, what are the true intentions of those participating in a game of little toddlers walking around looking for eggs? I fall into the camp that this is a joyful thing, something to have fun with – at the same time understanding the significance of Easter. It's possible to do both.
Posted by: KWM | October 26, 2009 at 12:29 PM
KWM,
Would you find anything wrong with Christians lighting up oil lamps to decorate their house on Diwali as there is nothing wrong with the isolated action of "lighting up oil lamps?"
My point is there is nothing wrong with dressing up and giving out candy. My question is the need to do it on Halloween day.
Regarding Easter eggs - I would contend that engaging in these non-biblical fun activities ultimately undermines the communication of the significance of the day. Scores of secular, cultural-church goers today associate easter with the kid-oriented activity of egg hunting.
I would contend the same for Christmas and x-mas trees. x-mas is already in my opinion turning into a self-serving shameful holiday of gifts and excesses. Case in point: See how the secular world has hijacked x-mas by replacing the central message of the birth of the savior with trees, decorations, gifts, rampant commercialism, "holiday" songs and the like.
I wouldn't look down upon or belittle a Christian engaging in Halloween. I would however advocate reasons to abstain from doing so. Hope this helps to clarify my position.
Posted by: kpolo | October 26, 2009 at 01:30 PM
We could look at it like this:
What if it was my family’s tradition to make Deluxe French Toast (which is amazing) on Easter morning for all the family before church? Year after year this is what we did.
Would the French toast tradition be a bad thing?
Posted by: KWM | October 26, 2009 at 01:54 PM
To sum up, celebrating a Christian holiday and fun activities are not mutually exclusive.
Posted by: KWM | October 26, 2009 at 02:05 PM
Hi kpolo,
>>”Would you find anything wrong with Christians lighting up oil lamps to decorate their house on Diwali as there is nothing wrong with the isolated action of "lighting up oil lamps?"
I would find this very peculiar indeed – mainly because they are performing a ritual that has a religious meaning to many Hindus. The practice is “owned” in other words. I don’t see the evidence for this with Halloween. I don't think the comparison is a valid one.
Posted by: KWM | October 26, 2009 at 02:14 PM
Is it at all possible that church is capitulating to the occult by giving up the holiday of All Hallows Eve to the pagans?
It's OUR holiday-- we co-opted it over the pagan harvest feasts and celebration of the occult when the church placed All Saints on November 1. That's what the church does: it gives the message of redemption by helping change pagans to Christians and pagan markings of time to faithful making of time.
Now churches offer generic "harvest festivals" as alternatives to the originally Christian holiday that attempted to "redeem" harvest festivals from their pagan origins! Which is most pagan in it's roots-- harvest festivals or All Saints Eve?
Not a big deal, and perhaps the church capitulated to the occult too long ago on this holiday for it to retain any redeeming value. But I don't think so, so I'm hanging on by taking the chance to teach my kids about the Saints of the church, living and dead, who witness to us about God's goodness. And I encourage them to dress in such a way as to inspire that thinking in others as they play games, thank God for his goodness, and eat lots of candy!
Posted by: Mike S | October 26, 2009 at 04:10 PM
KWM:
Having a tradition of doing something for a festival is not wrong. Turning the festival into an observance of the tradition is wrong. So have french toast is fine, but if 3 generations from now, someone in your household knows nothing about Easter other than "French toast" you have a problem.
Dressing up is definitely an "owned" practice of Halloween - dressing up in gory costumes. The fact that some choose not to adorn themselves in gory costumes would be the equivalent of putting up electrical lights for Diwali instead of oil lamps.
My point is the same: why do we feel the necessity to do anything on that day? Why not celebrate "reformation day" instead? Why not celebrate the Pentecost? Why not observe a Christian martyr's day to remind ourselves of the brothers and sisters who paid for their faith with their lives?
Can we not rise above this petty holiday called Halloween? Are Christians so deprived of reasons to celebrate or days to observe?
Posted by: kpolo | October 27, 2009 at 08:53 AM
Kpolo,
Let me say at the outset that I really understand and sympathize with your position – maybe more than you think I do.
>>”So have french toast is fine, but if 3 generations from now, someone in your household knows nothing about Easter other than "French toast" you have a problem.”
Of course that’s a problem, but that’s not what we were discussing. I was defending Easter egg hunts with my example. I never said, "throw out the true meaning of Easter in favor of more egg hunts." Of course if all one knows of Easter is egg hunts there is a problem. But you said, I believe, that they should be avoided. I disagree. You didn’t address my question about the Bible verses in the eggs. The whole point should be to understand the significance of the day – having an egg hunt for little ones hardly negates this. In other words, they can coexist.
>>”Dressing up is definitely an "owned" practice of Halloween - dressing up in gory costumes.”
When I said “owned,” I meant the practice of lighting oil lamps for Diwali is owned by the Hindus. It’s their practice. Which group owns Halloween? The Christians that I know, don’t attach any significance to the day – it’s meaningless. Dress-up and costumes – that’s it. This goes back to Greg's piece on intent.
>>”My point is the same: why do we feel the necessity to do anything on that day?”
I don’t think it’s a “necessity”. In other words, if for some odd reason (like being stuck in an airport) I missed Halloween this year I wouldn’t care one bit. If one the other hand, I missed Easter or Christmas, it would matter.
Posted by: KWM | October 27, 2009 at 09:33 AM
Mike S. have you ever read Deuteronomy chapter 12?
BTW, the naivete of this video is somewhere between shocking and laughable.
Is truth really a matter of personal opinion? Is it subjective?
Posted by: CSG | October 30, 2009 at 11:28 AM